In this episode of the M&A Launchpad Podcast, we talk with Sarah Dusek, entrepreneur and author of Thinking Bigger. Sarah’s mission is to inspire women to generate wealth and enter traditionally male-dominated spaces. Her book serves as a guide for anyone looking to grow their business.
Sarah’s journey began unexpectedly during the financial crisis while she was working for a nonprofit. Burned out, she turned to business as a means to drive change. Moving from the UK to Montana, she and her husband started Under Canvas, a successful glamping company. Initially set up on her husband’s farm, they later moved to Yellowstone and other territories, where the business flourished.
In 2018, an investment firm acquired Under Canvas, recognizing its potential for expansion. Facing challenges in securing capital for Under Canvas, Sarah decided to become a venture capitalist to help other women entrepreneurs. Her book, Thinking Bigger, aims to educate and empower people to scale their businesses.
Tune in to hear Sarah’s inspiring story and insights on entrepreneurship. For more information, visit her website.
In this podcast episode, we discuss:
- Creating the Glamping Industry
- Empowering Women Entrepreneurs
- Business Growth Strategies
- Overcoming Capital Challenges
You can connect with Sarah Dusek by website: Sarah Dusek | Author, Speaker, Entrepreneur & More (sarahhdusek.com)
Additional Resources:
- Access our archive of video interviews on YouTube
- Checkout our upcoming Conference – https://malaunchpad.com/
- Get in touch with show hosts Casey Minshew and Feras Moussa at – info@equitylaunchpad.com
- Looking to invest in M&A opportunities or partner with an advisor to acquire, scale or sell your business? Visit Equity Launchpad
Transcript
00:00 on today’s episode we interviewed Sarah
00:02 duk the co-founder of a company called
00:04 under canvas which is focused on
00:06 glamping which she can went on to sell
00:07 for over $100 million today she’s
00:10 focused on Venture capitalism and
00:12 focusing on really getting more women
00:14 exposure to entrepreneurialism and all
00:16 of the things of that so Casey what were
00:18 some of your takeaways from today’s
00:19 conversation yeah you know um I think we
00:22 all can think big right I mean as we
00:24 look at ourselves and say hey you know
00:26 I’ve got this idea I’ve got this concept
00:27 it’s always going back to like thinking
00:29 bigger and so for her to take a concept
01:32 of taking well by the way it’s amazing
01:34 beautiful tents making camping a lot
01:36 more fun to be able to then take that to
01:38 over a hundred million dollar I would
01:40 have never ever imagined that that could
01:42 have happened no and I agree I mean I
01:43 think it was definitely impressive right
01:45 I think they kind of stumbled into it
01:47 and like she said herself I mean
01:48 initially it was like Hey how do we
01:50 maybe make A1 $200,000 and just have a
01:52 good quality of life right and really
01:54 kind of stumbling into the idea having
01:57 some adversity right she kind of talked
01:58 about the storm and then learning to
01:00 build it up from there and she kind of
01:01 told the story of you know after that
01:03 first year that person’s like are going
01:04 to try this again and she’s like yes
01:06 right and they continued on and
01:07 ultimately you know made a big exit that
01:09 they probably weren’t expecting up front
01:10 and so super fascinating story and I
01:13 think she Dives in a lot on just some of
01:14 the you know adversity that you face as
01:16 a woman right and what kind of her
01:18 mission is today and how really making
01:21 that exit gave her the impact to be able
01:23 to go on and help educate more women
01:25 into the space yeah and I I’m absolutely
01:27 getting the book uh you know I have a
01:28 tremendous amount of thinking bigger
02:30 thinking bigger I have a strong you know
02:32 my family is full of powerful women and
02:35 these are things that she’s
02:36 communicating to we need more women in
02:38 entrepreneurship we need more women
02:40 buying companies and uh we really saw
02:42 that at our conference so I’m huge
02:44 supporter and I think uh I think it’s
02:46 just pretty fantastic what she’s doing
02:48 yeah I totally agree so I mean lots of
02:49 golden nuggets in this one so listen
02:54 in Sarah welcome to the show thank you
02:58 so much it’s great to be here guys thank
02:60 you to have you Sarah GL to have you so
02:02 Sarah you know we kind of went over a
02:04 little bit of your background but you
02:05 want to go to share to the audience a
02:06 little bit about yourself and kind of
02:07 how you got started in this
02:09 journey yeah absolutely I I’m an
02:11 entrepreneur and I I call myself an
02:14 accidental entrepreneur because I did
02:16 never imagine that I would build a
02:19 company I would never imagined becoming
02:22 an investor um and never imagine
02:25 imagined that I would grow and scale a
02:28 big company so um
03:31 I started my career working for
03:33 nonprofit organizations and I thought of
03:36 capitalism as the dark side making money
03:39 was definitely you know the Darth Vader
03:43 side of the Universe um but transitioned
03:48 um in the great F the middle of the
03:50 great financial crash of course which is
03:52 the perfect time to start thinking about
03:54 starting a business in the middle of a
03:56 recession yeah exactly greatest
03:58 financial crash of our lifetime you know
03:00 my lifetime up to that point um seemed
03:03 the perfect segue for transitioning into
03:06 pioneering a new business um and I ended
03:09 up building a company called under
03:11 canvas which is the largest glamping
03:14 company in the states
03:16 currently and built and grew and scaled
03:20 that business for a decade before
03:23 transitioning to becoming an
03:25 investor um and now transitioning again
03:30 and to going back to entrepreneurship
04:32 and building another travel company
04:34 whilst remaining an investor all right
04:36 so there’s a lot there so let’s go ahead
04:37 and just Dive Right In right because I
04:39 think I have about a million questions
04:40 so maybe the first qu I mean so
04:43 obviously you were in the nonprofit
04:44 mindset right
04:46 yeah the kind of the financial crisis
04:50 happens what led to actually deciding to
04:52 start a bit did you get laid off I guess
04:54 from the the charity let’s start there
04:56 what was a trigger that led you to
04:58 experienced burnout actually um I had
04:01 been working overseas for Aid
04:03 organizations for about eight years and
04:05 really hit a wall um was very burned out
04:10 very exhausted very tired and not in
04:13 good physical mental shape which meant I
04:17 ended up with about a year of being off
04:20 work effectively being off work sick um
04:23 which really made me think I probably
04:26 can’t go back to doing what I’ve been
04:27 doing for the last you know 8 years MH
05:31 um which caused sort of a crisis
05:34 personal crisis which you know in the
05:36 great Heroes story you know every great
05:39 story has a great moment of Crisis and
05:41 that was my great moment of Crisis
05:43 really I’m really questioning what am I
05:45 going to do with my life and what do I
05:47 care about what do I want and what
05:48 matters and um that really made me do a
05:53 big Soul search and I was quite
05:56 distressed because I loved the work that
05:57 I did um but I was frustrated with not
05:01 being able to drive enough change I
05:03 wanted to see like most people who care
05:07 I wanted to see a solve problems I want
05:09 us to wanted to see people’s lives being
05:11 better I wanted to make you know much
05:14 more progress and the conclusion I
05:16 eventually came to was you know Aid
05:18 agencies are not set up to be big
05:21 problem solvers but that businesses are
05:24 I mean the very root of why a business
05:26 exists right is to solve a problem
05:29 that’s what business does it’s it
06:31 innovates to solve a problem it creates
06:34 a solution to that problem the solution
06:36 has to be sustainable because you have
06:37 to keep making money otherwise the
06:39 business is going to fail and so what I
06:41 realized was gosh business is an amazing
06:44 vehicle um and business has the
06:47 potential to solve great problems in our
06:50 world it has the possibility for driving
06:53 change the moving us forward creating
06:56 Innovation and that really was the
06:58 beginning of my my journey into just you
06:01 know understanding and grappling with
06:05 business and thinking how what might
06:08 that look like for me I want to solve
06:10 big problems in the world how am I going
06:12 to do that and uh so it that ultimately
06:15 meant I got into a different vehicle and
06:19 started to discover what being in
06:22 business might look like as opposed to
06:24 working for a nonprofit organization so
06:26 in that it looks like so talk to us
06:29 about that so you made that shift how
07:31 did the glamping like how did that
07:33 become the idea because you know you did
07:35 it the hard way right we always talk
07:36 about you know buying something and then
07:38 building it up and you started from
07:40 scratch and so what was that I started
07:41 from scratch yeah and before our
07:43 glamping company we started a different
07:45 business which which we started from
07:47 scratch which failed because of the
07:50 great financial crash that sort of
07:51 rolled around um but then we got up and
07:54 started all over again and said okay
07:56 let’s go again let’s figure it out
07:58 what’s going to what’s going to be more
07:60 robust what’s going to work a bit like
07:01 when Co rolled around there were a lot
07:03 of businesses that went out of business
07:04 right because they just couldn’t
07:06 withstand um you know the climate of
07:10 recession and terrible Economic Times
07:13 and people being stuck in their homes I
07:15 mean
07:15 it was pretty challenging so we had to
07:19 go back to the drawing board I had to go
07:20 back to the drawing board and figure out
07:22 a new plan and for my sins I married
07:25 this amazing Montana man and he took me
07:29 out as you can tell tell from my accent
08:30 I am not from Montana you had me fall on
08:33 that
08:35 one I married this amazing guy um who
08:39 I’m still married to who was from
08:42 Montana and he took us as a family we
08:45 picked ourselves up from being in the UK
08:48 where I am from and moved back to the
08:51 Wilds of the Montana Prairie and that’s
08:56 when it hit me it’s like there was so
08:58 much Synergy I started my career in
08:00 Africa as an aid worker here and Montana
08:05 and Africa have a lot in common you know
08:07 Big Wide Open Spaces huge amounts of
08:10 wildlife extraordinary Vistas amazing
08:13 sunsets I mean it’s it’s beautiful if
08:16 you haven’t been to Montana there’s a
08:17 big plug for Montana it’s a beautiful
08:19 state not not to go on a tangent have
08:21 you seen Yellowstone of course I have I
08:23 feel like the whole company has been
08:25 exposed to Montana because of
08:26 Yellowstone so those haven’t seen the
08:29 show I think it’s a great show they’re
08:30 working on that last season which
09:31 apparently is all sorts of drama with
09:33 the actors but I think I used to live in
09:35 Seattle Washington so I kind of I’ve
09:37 been to Montana a few times been to to
09:39 Yellowstone Park and so yeah I think
09:41 that’s given exposure more recently for
09:43 the country just kind of what is Montana
09:44 like exactly when we we started our
09:46 business in Yellowstone um our first
09:50 glamping destination was in Yellowstone
09:52 okay we could have done with a bit of
09:53 Kevin Cosner we really could have yeah
09:56 well you married the real Kevin Coser so
09:57 we’ll just leave it at that I married
09:60 real Kevin Cosner there we go yes I did
09:03 um so we we moved back to Montana and
09:06 just we’re starting to think about oh
09:09 wow this connection with Africa Montana
09:11 and couldn’t quite figure it out but
09:12 there was some kind of like so piece of
09:14 the puzzle with like these these two
09:17 places have a Vibe and so we we we
09:20 decided to recreate the Safari
09:22 experience which was became what became
09:25 our glamping company ultimately that was
09:27 the Genesis of the idea could we could
09:30 we reimagine the Safari experience in a
10:32 for an American audience but you know
10:36 somehow connecting beautiful places
10:39 incredible Vistas and amazing The
10:41 Amazing Outdoors that the US has um and
10:44 somehow bringing beautiful tents into
10:46 the mix so that was the original idea
10:49 got it so then the first one you landed
10:50 on Yellowstone Park just so yeah walk us
10:55 through just walk you know just the kind
10:56 of the just walk us through the
10:57 beginning of that right you go find a
10:59 piece of land you know what were you
10:01 looking to invest what was ultimately
10:03 what were you looking to make right it
10:05 was in your mind okay if we make 200,000
10:07 a year I’m happy kind of thing and we’re
10:08 gonna go try to do it off this one or
10:10 two locations or you know from you I was
10:13 an aid worker so if someone said to me
10:15 you could make $200,000 a year I’d have
10:17 been like wow I’ve hit the jackpot Sarah
10:19 you weren’t thinking bigger all right
10:20 there’s a plug free book we’ll talk
10:21 about that a little bit later exactly we
10:24 really were not and we we originally we
10:26 did not originally the concept was
10:29 wasn’t born in Yellowstone but we we
11:32 opened our first proper glamping camp in
11:34 Yellowstone but we originally started on
11:36 my husband’s family’s Farm um with this
11:39 idea of creating a you know a form sort
11:42 of wildlife fairy experience for um very
11:47 high-end sort of paying customers um to
11:49 come out to the Prairie
11:52 and you know so that basically didn’t
11:56 work um which meant we had to you know
11:59 adjust just the idea pivot the idea
11:01 which was then you know we came up with
11:03 the idea well let’s take the con the
11:05 concept’s good we knew the people were
11:06 loving the concept they just weren’t
11:09 loving where we were doing the concept
11:12 destination their destination wasn’t a
11:15 destination so we picked up our
11:17 beautiful tents that my husband had
11:19 designed and we you know we started over
11:21 again um this time in in Yellowstone and
11:25 yes we leased land originally in
11:27 Yellowstone from from an amazing land
11:29 Doner
12:30 and set up camp literally set up camp in
12:33 yellow just outside of West Yellowstone
12:36 go and how many acres did yall Le and
12:38 you know how much did y’all kind of
12:39 invest I guess all it and how big were
12:41 these first tents as well just to kind
12:42 of give the audience perspective right
12:43 like what is the experience you
12:45 delivered that’s kind of maybe the three
12:46 questions in one yeah um we leased 10
12:50 acres initially when we first started um
12:54 and we put up
12:55 25 Safari style tents um so they all had
12:01 um big you know bed and chest of drawers
12:05 and you know nice chairs and bathroom
12:09 some of the tents had nice bathrooms wow
12:11 so this is an experience wood stove yeah
12:14 I mean not like camping in any way um
12:17 really Posh camping um camping done for
12:21 you in a very nice way but our first
12:24 version of the business was obviously
12:26 you know much more rustic and much more
12:28 simple than it than is today um but it
13:32 was it’s a creative way to say a little
13:33 bit more budget for the for the people
13:36 for R experience let’s just say that
13:39 there was a lot more budget in the mix
13:41 than there was today and I we basically
13:42 funded the business through credit cards
13:44 I mean we had we had no our had given us
13:49 um an my inals had given us uh an
13:52 initial sort of um a piece of our
13:55 inheritance to invest in our first
13:59 business but we’d used all that money up
13:01 on building our first prototype if you
13:04 like you know on the on their farm and
13:07 so there was nothing left after that and
13:10 so we were we were basically financing
13:12 the business through through credit
13:14 cards and the odd loan for equipment
13:17 here and there but it was was was brutal
13:20 I don’t recommend it yeah so let me ask
13:23 you this in that in that process right
13:25 of financing your business through
13:26 credit card you must have you must have
13:28 saw something there must have been some
14:30 type of magic that you saw like hey
14:33 there’s something here it’s worth the
14:35 adventure so what was that Magic that
14:37 the dot that connected for you guys yeah
14:40 the demand I think what we saw when we
14:41 first put up tents at Jake’s F whil
14:44 people didn’t necessarily want to come
14:46 and stay with us at the F they did love
14:48 the tents and so we knew we were on to
14:52 something because people would call us
14:55 and say where where did you get your
14:56 tents like I love those tents CU you
14:58 know we beautiful imagery out on the
14:01 internet you know this was before the
14:02 days of Instagram can you imagine um but
14:05 it was around the same kind of time as
14:07 Airbnb was launching and you know we
14:10 were putting great imagery out on the
14:12 web and people were finding it and
14:14 discovering it and calling us up and
14:16 saying I love your tents like I want
14:18 them like and we were like well you
14:21 could come and stay and they were like
14:23 no don’t thank
14:26 you so we realized there was that we had
14:30 something and I that’s what I always
15:31 tell to entrepreneurs these days it’s
15:33 like trying to
15:35 understand what what the core of what
15:38 your customer wants is like what makes a
15:41 business special is always about trying
15:43 to understand the elements of success
15:45 and it’s the same when you you buy a
15:47 business or you invest in a business
15:48 like you’re trying to understand what is
15:51 it about that business that makes it
15:55 work and
15:57 often yeah exactly there’s one or two
15:59 core elements that usually are like you
15:01 know the piesta resistance the thing
15:03 that makes that business hum um either
15:06 it’s particular product or a particular
15:08 thing and in our case it was our tents
15:11 you know the tents were like our magic
15:14 formula and you know we just needed to
15:16 put them in the right place for their
15:19 because there was demand people people
15:21 were interested we were there was it was
15:24 enthusiasm we just had to figure out
15:26 what do we do with that enthusiasm how
15:28 do we make it make sense from a
15:30 financial perspective got it so who were
16:33 I mean what was I guess what were you
16:35 charging right initially and who were
16:37 your first set of customers right are we
16:39 are we talking you know California
16:41 hippies or Silicon Valley techies or you
16:44 know what is it that that following that
16:46 you really started yeah they were your
16:48 average visitors to to Yellowstone
16:51 National Park we had all sorts of people
16:54 stay with us that summer and we charged
16:56 we had three different types of tents
16:58 that first year we started we charged I
16:00 think we charged like $89 a night for
16:03 one tent type
16:05 $189 for another tent type and
16:08 $289 for another tent type the $289 tent
16:12 had a bathroom in it so private bathroom
16:15 and the other two shared bathrooms so
16:17 there was like a communal bathroom block
16:20 um that you had to use it wasn’t in your
16:21 tent so it’s all got a lot more refined
16:25 from then but so we were you know we
16:27 were pricing ourselves from a sort of of
16:29 a fairly mainstream pricing point with
17:32 like you know you could stay in a hotel
17:34 for that same price or you could come
17:35 and stay in a tent and at the time I
17:37 didn’t know if anyone would pay you know
17:40 over $100 for staying in a tent I mean
17:42 that was pretty unheard of at the time
17:45 that you know you would pay the same
17:47 price to stay in a hotel or stay in a
17:50 tent I we we didn’t know we didn’t know
17:52 whether people would do that or not I
17:54 will tell you this if we go if I ever go
17:56 in a tent my wife is going to be in the
17:58 $289
17:00 well that’s what we realized pretty
17:02 quickly it was like people actually
17:04 don’t want the cheaper tents they want
17:06 the 289 the 389 the 489 you know it was
17:10 like we had just barely scratched the
17:12 surface of what the demand actually was
17:16 and you know the business learned over
17:19 over the years that actually the nicer
17:21 The Experience actually more the demand
17:24 I think you can probably tell me but I’m
17:26 guessing what you learned is people are
17:29 fatuated with the idea of camping right
18:31 yes not experience of it but not the
18:34 fundamentals of like being out and
18:36 outside with the bugs right and so a way
18:38 to Bridge and get an experience right
18:40 yeah exactly and that’s what we realized
18:42 we were we could be a bridge to the
18:44 outdoors in a way that was comfortable
18:46 and relatively affordable and you could
18:49 create magical memories and have
18:51 campfires with your kids and make
18:53 s’mores at night and then go back to a
18:56 beautiful tent with plush Linens and
18:58 flushing to toilet and you know warm bed
18:01 and not have to not have to you have
18:04 service in the morning someone can bring
18:05 you coffee in the morning and magical
18:09 don’t have to rough it team experience
18:11 we take out so I guess how did you
18:14 realize you had something that was
18:15 starting you know starting to think
18:17 bigger right so you had the 10 acres you
18:19 had the tents you’re getting what what
18:21 point you’re like hey maybe we start to
18:22 scale this out and what did that look
18:24 like right yeah did you start hiring you
18:26 know what was that operation that very
18:29 first first summer uh we oper when we
19:31 operated our business for the first year
19:33 with 2510 in Yellowstone we realized
19:36 that very first year that actually um we
19:42 could scale this business we realized oh
19:44 gosh we could not just create one Camp
19:46 outside of Yellowstone but actually we
19:48 could go to other national parks and do
19:51 something very similar so I uh it was a
19:55 pretty crazy summer though because um so
19:58 many things went terribly horribly wrong
19:01 and you know the product wasn’t perfect
19:04 and it was our first attempt and we’d
19:06 never run a hotel before we weren’t
19:08 Hotel years didn’t have a Hospitality
19:10 background it was you know nobody had
19:13 built glamping sites before so it wasn’t
19:15 like you could just go oh that’s how you
19:16 do it you know you go over there and you
19:18 look at how someone else is doing it and
19:19 you do it it wasn’t like that um but
19:22 that first summer we knew um we knew
19:26 that there was a there was the possib
19:28 there was the Genesis of like this could
20:30 be something else and I remember one of
20:32 my guys who was working for me at the
20:35 time and he said said to me towards the
20:36 end of the summer he said do you think
20:37 you’ll do this again and I said oh yes
20:41 of course we will and we’re going to do
20:43 more and he was like what are you crazy
20:47 don’t you remember how hard this was
20:49 this was
20:52 awful um but yeah that that first summer
20:55 we just started to think about scale and
20:57 started to think about okay what would
20:58 that take to do more than we’d already
20:00 done and you know the idea of you should
20:03 perfect what you’ve got before you think
20:05 about scale you know should you make
20:08 what you’ve got better before you do
20:10 more or should you do more and you know
20:12 fix it along the way you know all those
20:14 things started to to come up
20:16 entrepreneurs
20:17 dilemma yeah exactly and we we
20:20 instinctively thought we should you know
20:23 figure out how to do this better but
20:25 let’s do more of it at the same time so
20:27 take us through to the 2009 is when this
20:30 started right that was your first summer
21:32 in 2009 and then you’ve scaled the
21:35 company to over hundred
21:37 million right in 2018 so just yeah talk
21:41 to us about that Journey because one of
21:43 the things you shared when we originally
21:44 talking you know your passion is for to
21:47 to encourage women to start thinking
21:49 this way and to grow their business
21:52 right so just I know it’s hard to talk I
21:54 mean you could talk for hours about that
21:56 one Journey but what were those big
21:58 highlights that for the female listeners
21:00 that are listening that encourage them
21:03 to take those Journeys yeah well I our
21:06 journey was really marred by failure
21:08 right I mean I my my best lessons were
21:11 all learned from stuff that didn’t go
21:13 well and didn’t go right actually took
21:15 us three years from 2009 when we first
21:18 came up with the idea of sort of
21:19 creating a safari experience to
21:23 2012 of putting the first proper camp in
21:26 Yellowstone so we had sort of three
21:28 years there of trying to find product
22:31 Market fit trying to like figure out the
22:34 business model figure out what wasn’t
22:36 working what people wanted and and be
22:39 brave enough to adjust and what I would
22:43 say is that so often what inhibits us
22:48 from building something big is settling
22:51 for something that just about
22:54 works and I say that to to say you know
22:59 we get we think oh I’ve built a company
22:01 that does half a million do of Revenue
22:03 or I built a company does a million
22:04 dollars of Revenue or $2 million of
22:05 Revenue and and this works without
22:08 thinking or asking the question is there
22:11 a way to do $10 million or $100 million
22:14 like what would that look like and and
22:16 just because something just about works
22:19 and you can make it profitable and you
22:20 can pay yourself a good living Etc
22:23 sometimes that that is the the thing
22:26 that is our you know our ceiling
22:29 and I say to women all the time it’s
23:31 like don’t let good be the enemy of
23:35 great don’t let something that just
23:37 about Works um I used to obviously
23:40 because we built glamping camps we we
23:43 used to build septic systems with every
23:46 Resort that we ever built I got really
23:48 good at understanding what happens to
23:50 poop but often in a septic system the
23:53 engineers would tell me oh it just about
23:55 perks which means it just about the
23:59 system will just about work the the the
23:02 system will flow and it’s like don’t
23:04 settle for something that just about
23:07 works and the the task and the challenge
23:11 is to not just you know exist with
23:14 something that just about works but but
23:16 go for something that absolutely shoots
23:18 the lights out because it’s basically
23:20 the Sim M work right to find something
23:23 that shoots the lights out
23:25 versus um just about you can make a
23:28 living and it’s quite ni it’s quite good
24:30 don’t settle and effectively you know we
24:34 figured out we had a business that just
24:38 about worked but we figured that isn’t
24:41 this isn’t scalable it’s not it’s not
24:43 you know we can we can just about make a
24:46 living etc etc but that’s what forced us
24:49 to Pivot into figuring out our national
24:52 park model and building much larger
24:54 scale clamping Resorts was was thinking
24:59 can we can we do something bigger can we
24:03 do something at scale and you know
24:06 failure it’s easier to do that when
24:09 you’re failing it’s harder to do that
24:10 when you’ve got something that that
24:12 works and and trading that in for
24:15 something that’s better complacency I
24:17 mean that kills the entrepreneurial
24:18 Spirit right and so you see that time
24:20 and time again yeah I don’t know it’s
24:23 just even compacity I think we just we
24:26 get stuck it’s hard to see that there
24:29 could be more when you’ve got something
25:31 that’s good or something that’s working
25:33 or that you know you can generate enough
25:34 money to live Etc you don’t need more
25:37 it’s like so why why do more and it’s
25:41 you know I say to women all the time
25:42 it’s like you know building big
25:45 businesses is about using your influence
25:49 and your power to do something really
25:52 really great and actually there are very
25:55 few of us who are doing that in the
25:57 world and actually that’s the reason to
25:60 make more money that’s the reason to
25:03 have any kind of ambition it’s like what
25:04 am I going to do with that because
25:06 actually making money in itself is not
25:08 hugely satisfying right right you know
25:10 you buy the boat you buy the house it’s
25:14 it’s fun for five minutes right but it’s
25:16 not it’s not massively like rewarding
25:20 what’s really rewarding is having a
25:23 great sense of purpose and vision and
25:26 Mission and contributing and feeling
25:28 fulfilled by by what you do right and if
26:30 you get to make great money at the same
26:32 time as doing that then that is the
26:33 icing on the cake but it’s like how you
26:37 know how can we how can we think about
26:40 Levering ourselves we driving change
26:44 making a difference and taking all our
26:46 skills and our wisdom and our knowledge
26:48 and allowing that to propel us to
26:50 building a better world for
26:52 everybody I mean money is about
26:54 influence right like I said a person
26:56 with 10 million doesn’t live very
26:57 differently a person with 20 which is
26:59 not different than that different than a
26:00 person with 40 right there gets a kind
26:02 of a upper bound and from there it’s
26:04 about influence and impacting the things
26:05 you care about that’s really ultimately
26:08 you know how I see it as well um but
26:10 that’s that’s that’s it right there it’s
26:12 like and how can you use your influence
26:14 to make other other people’s lives
26:16 better and make our world better that’s
26:18 it love it I was I was gonna ask just
26:21 kind of in that so now you get to 2018
26:24 right yeah and you so in your
26:27 relationship husband and wife
26:29 obviously somebody’s the the Visionary
27:31 somebody’s the integrator right
27:33 someone’s in in that relationship so are
27:36 you now stuck with how do I exit my
27:39 business and at what point did that okay
27:42 okay no no we were not planning when we
27:46 exited our business we were not planning
27:48 to exit our business um and you know and
27:51 that’s the interesting thing I think
27:52 about building great companies uh when
27:54 you build great companies people
27:56 instinctively want to buy them um people
27:59 want to buy companies for all sorts of
27:01 reasons right but if you build something
27:03 great somebody’s going to want to have
27:05 someone’s going to want it and um that’s
27:09 what happened to us in
27:11 2018 and an investment firm came along
27:15 and could see what we had done and could
27:19 see that there was still a journey and
27:20 there was still plenty more national
27:22 parks to go to that we hadn’t developed
27:25 in yet that that were blue sky for the
27:27 company and we’re super excited about
28:31 taking the company on the next leg of
28:33 its
28:34 Journey got it so maybe really quick
28:37 before we kind of talk about the
28:38 transaction what were just some of the
28:40 you know the biggest impact hires that
28:41 you did right from between 2012 to 18
28:46 right was it like taking the step to get
28:47 a person that you know like for example
28:49 a CFO or was it something a person that
28:52 built the septic tanks because that was
28:53 the biggest challenge like what was it
28:55 ultimately that you know that you felt
28:57 like this really moved the Needle on the
28:59 company yeah I knew after the very first
28:02 year in Yellowstone that I was not a
28:05 hotelier and that I did not have all the
28:08 knowledge on the expertise about
28:10 operating a a tented Hotel I mean nobody
28:13 did in the world at that time but
28:14 effectively we needed someone who knew
28:17 how to operate a hotel um so that was
28:20 the first big hire we made and we went
28:23 out and hired effectively a COO who
28:26 would be our chief operating officer who
28:29 knew how to run hotels and that was the
29:33 best thing I ever did because it freed
29:37 us up to to do what we were good at
29:39 which was imagining and creating and
29:42 focusing on Business Development while
29:44 someone else’s job was to focus on okay
29:47 how do I execute on what we’ve got how
29:50 do I make what we’ve got better how do I
29:52 put in the systems and processes that we
29:55 need to run this as an efficient
29:57 operating machine
29:59 um and create great
29:01 experiences but you know had expertise
29:04 of having done that before so that was
29:06 key for me and often often I think for
29:10 entrepreneurs in particular we get stuck
29:14 with so this is why I love this question
29:16 it’s another limiting factor right we
29:18 get stuck by what we know and we think
29:22 well I know what I know and I have to
29:24 stay in that lane actually you just have
29:26 to hire what you don’t know right you
29:28 have to hire the expertise that you
30:30 don’t have and bring it in and that’s
30:32 you know a massive component of what
30:35 helps any business grow and scale and
30:39 you just have to be brave enough and
30:40 smart enough to hire the right people
30:42 and get them in the room with you to to
30:44 grow something and build something
30:46 extraordinary that’s what’s tough about
30:48 starting a new I mean as an entrepreneur
30:49 right you did it all at the beginning
30:51 and so you know how to do it and that’s
30:53 where it leads to complacency and I
30:54 almost have to drill this with my
30:55 partner too about like let go of things
30:58 let people do it and they’re going to do
30:59 the 80% of the way you do it and that’s
30:01 fine right but it’s it’s hard because
30:03 you know how to do it than you could do
30:05 them it works and so it’s like you know
30:07 change it’s a mind shift and it’s a you
30:09 know you really have to shift how you
30:11 think about it and you know focus on the
30:13 bigger picture so yeah 100% well it’s
30:16 and it’s often hard to think that anyone
30:18 could possibly do a better job than you
30:20 could do
30:21 it but they most definitely can and and
30:26 that’s you know I think that getting the
30:27 right people on the bus to go on a
30:29 journey with you is is absolutely key I
31:32 had a good Mentor that told me one time
31:34 it’s who not how and he actually had me
31:36 WR read that book right just to to stop
31:39 thinking about you know how how how and
31:41 no no find who can do it who just who
31:44 who knows how who who knows how
31:47 basically is what you need and that’s
31:49 what we needed um and I think often the
31:51 journey is trying to figure
31:53 out who who is it that you need to go on
31:56 the next leg of your journey what is the
31:58 expertise and who knows who who would be
31:01 good at leading and executing on this
31:03 next piece of the puzzle to help you go
31:05 on that journey and you know effectively
31:08 we don’t need to be the smartest people
31:10 in the room we just need to get the
31:12 smartest people in the room with us um
31:15 and and we need to lead those people and
31:17 Wrangle those people but that’s that’s
31:19 really the job I think of any business
31:21 owner or leader is to keep putting the
31:24 right people in the room I think job of
31:26 leaders to create more leaders I am for
31:28 to find smarter people because if I do
32:30 not I’m in serious trouble me
32:35 too me too got it so then maybe just to
32:39 bring it back home for the transaction
32:41 so you guys built it up for an
32:43 additional six years you got that Co in
32:46 you weren’t really thinking of sailing
32:47 and you know what was that initial phone
32:51 call or interaction like and at what
32:53 point were you guys like hey maybe we
32:54 should sell and why what was that
32:55 motivating factor yeah we went out to
32:58 raise more Capital um so we had raised
32:01 Capital the year before I had deployed
32:03 all that Capital executed on it really
32:06 really well and we were really growing
32:08 really really quickly and I knew we
32:10 would need to raise more Capital if we
32:11 were going to continue to grow and I
32:14 went out to raise more capital and um
32:18 the folks that came to the table would
32:20 just happen to be really interesting
32:22 interested in acquiring it from
32:26 us got it so then you just go back home
33:30 to your husband and you’re like hey you
33:32 know what if instead of raising Capital
33:34 we you know made an exit here right and
33:38 yeah did youall see it I guess you
33:39 people look at exits multiple different
33:41 ways right one way is to transition into
33:43 a new role as a person another way is
33:46 hey this will accelerate the company
33:47 because we have deeper Pockets right and
33:50 you know I mean what was you know kind
33:51 of what was the the thought process on
33:53 the side certainly that was was a big
33:55 thing for us that you know actually you
33:57 know could we accelerate the business
33:59 more by bringing people in who had a lot
33:01 deeper Pockets than than we did and
33:05 could we you know continue to could
33:07 continue to see the business grow in
33:09 scale by bringing in partners with
33:11 different expertise different you know
33:13 knowledge wisdom you know could it take
33:16 the business to a whole another league
33:18 and it seemed like that was sort of the
33:21 most
33:23 obvious solution to you know okay the
33:26 business needs more Capital but maybe
33:28 the business also needs to
33:29 professionalize itself and adapt and
34:31 change and grow and you know maybe
34:34 there’s at the time we weren’t thinking
34:37 that there would be life for us beyond
34:39 the transaction the time we were still
34:41 very much focused on on growing the
34:44 company um but it
34:48 it it evolved I mean and that’s
34:52 transactions do that they evolve and
34:54 then they help help you to you know see
34:57 the world and
34:58 with different eyes so you obviously got
34:01 a term sheet right so this group it
34:03 sounds like it’s a private Equity Group
34:04 they they provide you a term sheet and
34:07 so then did you have to find somebody
34:09 that was your expert to walk you guys
34:11 through that or were you pretty much at
34:13 this point you now have this Acumen to
34:15 be able to to manage it how did how did
34:17 you guys get through that yeah I we we
34:19 had legal council on our side because
34:22 we’d already raised money before so it
34:24 wasn’t it wasn’t wildly different than
34:27 the previous rays that had done before
34:29 obviously the difference was being that
35:31 we were going to take Capital out of the
35:33 business as opposed to putting all the
35:35 capital into the business um so it
35:38 wasn’t wildly different for me than any
35:41 previous transactions I had
35:44 done um apart from the fact that there
35:46 were few more lawyers at the table than
35:49 they had been previously and few more
35:52 accountants and a few more advisors and
35:56 um yeah it it was quite a quite a beast
35:59 and certainly fairly intimidating
35:01 because you know a lot of the language
35:04 around a transaction is new you know you
35:08 haven’t necessarily done it before and
35:10 it can be intimidating and overwhelming
35:15 and scary but that’s why you that’s why
35:18 you hire experts right you hire people
35:21 to help you navigate you know the small
35:24 print and help you understand try and
35:28 help you understand what everything
35:29 means I I don’t know that you ever come
36:31 out of a transaction feeling like you
36:34 totally understood everything that was
36:35 happening all the same time but you know
36:38 that’s life that’s part of the ride yeah
36:42 so it sounds like then you guys made
36:44 your exit yep did you did you and did
36:47 and I you stayed on for a period of time
36:50 did yeah okay and then it looks like you
36:54 got the yeah I remained CEO for about a
36:56 year post post post um the the
36:60 transaction um and uh fully exited uh in
36:04 January
36:05 2020 fantastic and then talk to me about
36:08 this ernstson Young Award so it sounds
36:10 like uh you had been uh pretty amazing
36:15 that was yeah that was 2017 so prior to
36:17 our transaction um um I became a ey
36:22 winning woman um UI selects half a dozen
36:26 to a you know 10 women a year from
36:29 around the country uh and Canada of
37:32 women who are growing and scaling um
37:35 incredible businesses and I was very
37:37 privileged to have become one of them in
37:39 2017 and quick question and in 2019 how
37:42 big was the organization just to kind of
37:44 give you know by the time I left we
37:47 probably had about 600 employees
37:50 including seasonal staff um and we had
37:54 seven
37:55 locations so yeah it had almost 100
37:58 people per location wow I thought you
37:00 were going to tell me more locations
37:01 that’s a lot of people it’s a hotel yeah
37:04 it’s a lot of it was a lot of people
37:06 well including you know probably about
37:07 100 of those corporate um folks and the
37:12 rest on sites yeah it’s was a lot of
37:15 people was a lot of people I mean I’m in
37:17 the property management world and people
37:19 can make it the most fun and the most
37:22 difficult business in the world at the
37:23 same time so yeah Ian I think I think
37:26 that’s one of the hardest parts about
37:28 growing and scaling a business right is
38:30 navigating building a great company for
38:33 the people who work in the company um
38:36 and that’s especially Hospitality I mean
38:38 it’s very people heavy in all aspects
38:40 from because again we’re in the property
38:42 management but it’s the same idea right
38:44 you’re managing or your tenants and you
38:47 know just just like so it’s it’s it’s
38:49 all about the culture and getting the
38:50 right people the right
38:52 seats s that’s an amazing story Amazing
38:55 Story and I’m glad you shared it with us
38:57 so what we jump into what you’re working
38:59 the the what are you doing today yeah
38:00 let’s get on to the book let’s talk
38:02 about the good the other good stuff well
38:03 yeah talk about the book and what else
38:05 you’re doing today yeah yeah juicy juicy
38:08 stuff um one of the things I from
38:11 growing and scaling under canvas that I
38:13 realized was actually it was quite hard
38:16 for me as a female CEO to raise capital
38:19 and the capital raising Journey was
38:22 challenging and difficult and not just
38:25 because I was female but because didn’t
38:28 necessarily understand the requirements
39:31 or the metrics or the you know what
39:35 investors look for in businesses and so
39:38 it was hard to talk the same language as
39:42 folks when I didn’t know it’s like you
39:44 know playing a board game and not
39:45 knowing what the rules are right that
39:47 that’s kind of what it felt like um
39:49 trying to raise capital I just didn’t
39:51 know what the rules were um so it was it
39:54 felt difficult to play and was difficult
39:55 to play and took me two or three we
39:58 bootstrapped for a very very long time
39:01 um longer than probably was ideal for
39:03 sure um and that was largely because I
39:07 just wasn’t particularly well networked
39:10 wasn’t particularly understanding what
39:12 you know what the what the game was and
39:14 how you played it um and and what I
39:16 realized was you know I maybe
39:20 encountered one female VC the entire
39:23 time I was meeting folks um trying to
39:26 raise capital and I spoke to hundreds
39:28 and hundreds of of folks and that made
40:32 me
40:33 realize there may be something wrong
40:36 here there’s things I don’t know which I
40:39 at the time I just thought was
40:42 me um but one of the things I realized
40:45 post becoming an investor myself and now
40:47 investing in other
40:49 entrepreneurs um I realized the things I
40:52 didn’t know a lot of women don’t know
40:54 and I wasn’t unusual it wasn’t there
40:57 wasn’t something
40:58 espcially dumb about me um it was just I
40:02 was not in the in the realm not living
40:06 and working in the realm that many
40:08 people have just grown up with and know
40:10 and understand and so um I became a
40:14 bench capitalist After exiting under
40:17 canvas and we focused on investing in
40:20 female entrepreneurs um and specifically
40:24 wrote a book uh telling our about our
40:27 own canvas Journey but also helping
40:30 designed to help other women understand
41:33 what it takes to build and scale a big
41:34 business and what it takes to get funded
41:37 so the book is called um thinking bigger
41:40 a pitch formul for women who want to
41:42 change the world because I am a woman
41:45 who wants to change the world uh and
41:47 I’ve been able to do that a little bit
41:49 by thinking bigger so the idea is to
41:51 help other women other entrepreneurs
41:54 think about um building and scaling and
41:56 thinking bigger than they do today and
41:59 practically distilling some of the rules
41:01 of the game about how we get funded how
41:04 we scale a business um how we put fuel
41:07 into into a business to help it
41:10 grow using your money and influence to
41:13 influence others like we talked about
41:15 right so indeed no and I’m very glad
41:17 you’re doing that you know I have a
41:18 family and I have a lot of powerful
41:20 women around me and uh it’s just it’s
41:23 great to see you know that and we talk
41:25 about that here at uh at Equity
41:26 Launchpad you know is we just had a
41:28 great conference and we met a small
42:31 group of females that want to go out and
42:32 buy and acquire companies and we think
42:35 that it should be bigger that room
42:37 should have been half full of females
42:39 and males right a big thing I got two
42:42 daughters and same thing and just kind
42:44 of get them you know literally teaching
42:45 my daughter about investing the other
42:46 day and she’s like when are we going to
42:47 invest the money and I’m like well you
42:48 got to get a little bit more to be able
42:50 to buy a chair but really getting um
42:52 exposure to that I mean I little had
42:53 that conversation with her two days ago
42:55 so that’s it isn’t it it’s about
42:57 exposure it’s about this is hard it’s
42:60 just awareness it’s awareness it’s and
42:03 know but then knowledge is power right
42:04 and then if you have knowledge and you
42:06 you have opportunity you can use it um
42:10 and you know I just I didn’t have an all
42:14 knowledge and the sad reality is that
42:17 all of other women don’t too and it’s
42:18 like we have to expose ourselves um get
42:22 smarter so we can catch up and so that
42:25 we can play because um there’s really no
42:27 reason why we can’t there’s no reason
42:29 why we can’t buy businesses no reason
43:31 why we can’t build businesses um we just
43:35 you know we need to sometimes just
43:38 understand what the game is so that you
43:40 can play it and if you can understand
43:41 what the game is then you can play and
43:44 um you know it’s fun it’s fun it’s fun
43:47 playing the game love it no it’s it’s a
43:50 game of life so that’s that and then
43:52 feeling comfortable taking on the risk
43:53 because you know one of the things that
43:55 I do find with when I speak to emails
43:59 about it it’s there is that risk trade
43:01 that I think a lot of the guys have been
43:04 used to playing for risk and doing these
43:06 things and I think that you know it’s
43:08 helping them understand that you know
43:09 there is risk involved but that’s how we
43:12 solve problems we solve it through those
43:15 yeah you’re 100% right women are
43:17 definitely
43:19 generically obviously there are those of
43:22 us who are the exception but um there’s
43:25 stats written about how women L business
43:27 businesses take four times less they
44:31 borrow four times less money than mail
44:33 Le businesses which is about risk right
44:37 that that is purely entirely about
44:40 worrying about overloading your business
44:43 with capital Risk by taking loans so
44:46 women typically underfund their
44:48 businesses because they’re worried about
44:50 risk and worry about um you know
44:55 consequences infinitely more
44:58 than men traditionally do which is I me
44:03 I’m sure there are so many reasons for
44:05 that um but it it is interesting because
44:09 that is probably one of the biggest
44:11 things that holds women back the
44:12 inability to take big swings and take
44:14 big risks and be willing to lose be
44:17 willing to
44:18 fail that’s that is part of the game and
44:22 we do have to get we have to get better
44:24 at it and I think I think it’s
44:26 repetition right because again if you
44:28 have a if you’re a woman and you have a
44:29 successful company right you might feel
45:31 impostor syndrome and so last thing you
45:33 want to do is like well I got this far
45:35 and it’s been hard and I don’t want to
45:37 you know take on the risk and lose it
45:39 all versus you know as a guy we fell
45:42 we’ve been in that position maybe a few
45:44 times because we’ve taken that risk and
45:45 so it’s a little bit of you know just
45:48 getting as you as the more and more
45:51 women get expose right they start to get
45:52 more comfortable with it right because
45:54 Sarah took on the risk and it worked out
45:55 they can point to 50 people that took
45:57 the risk and you know succeeded I think
45:60 you’re 100% right imposter syndrome is
45:02 huge for women because there is a very
45:05 big sense of like you know I had to
45:07 prove myself to get in the room it’s
45:10 hard to be in the room um and you
45:12 therefore you when you’re in the room
45:14 you don’t want to risk messing it up
45:17 right but in inadvertently you then do
45:21 that by not taking risks I mean that’s I
45:24 I’ve spoken to so many entrepreneurs you
45:26 know even even those who have raised
45:29 Capital often don’t want to take risks
46:31 to risk the money that they just raised
46:34 and it’s was like if you don’t take some
46:36 big swings and you don’t take risks you
46:38 are going to lose the money you just
46:40 raised because your business is going to
46:41 fail and it’s it’s it’s a it’s a
46:44 double-edged sword and and you’re quite
46:46 right it’s hard to get in the room and
46:48 then you don’t want to lose your spot
46:50 you don’t want to mess it up but you’re
46:52 right that’s that’s that’s why that’s
46:54 why I tell my story and you know because
46:57 we can see it we can be it you know and
46:59 we’ve got to we’ve got to take we’ve got
46:03 to take big risks and you know recognize
46:05 that failure is part of the Journey of
46:09 of of eventually
46:11 succeeding I love it and that is that is
46:13 fantastic absolutely awesome story well
46:15 Sarah we’re gonna jump into our rocket
46:18 round but before we do that just where
46:20 can people the name of the book one more
46:22 time is thinking bigger a pitch deck
46:25 formula for women who want to change the
46:27 world it’s available for pre-order on
46:29 Amazon right now um and you can also get
47:32 in touch with me through my website
47:34 Sarah
47:37 hd.com all right we’ll put that in the
47:39 show notes for the listeners case you
47:41 want to go through the rocket round all
47:42 right so our rocket round for the
47:43 listeners we always ask three questions
47:45 to get to know our guest much better um
47:48 and usually they’re not about business
47:50 right but it is a little bit about
47:51 business everything’s it so quick first
47:53 question is what do you like to do in
47:54 your free time Sarah
47:57 the World Travel I love to travel I am
47:01 an obsessive absolute travel junkie noad
47:05 is what I was telling her and you want
47:06 to share to the audience where you are
47:07 right now I’m in Cape Town Cape Town
47:09 South Africa Town South Africa awesome
47:12 all right next question what was the
47:14 most memorable moment in your business
47:17 JY oh easy our first year in Yellowstone
47:21 we had a massive storm roll in and
47:26 complet completely flatten the
47:29 camp and it looked like our business was
48:33 done we were over we were wiped out I
48:36 mean like you know like a hurricane
48:38 comes in and wipes a city out that’s
48:40 what it felt like with this massive
48:42 storm coming in and completely wiping
48:43 out our camp and we often say now that
48:47 if we we manage to survive that come
48:49 back from a really big storm and if we
48:52 can survive that we can do anything so
48:55 uh it was very memorable for all the
48:57 wrong reasons but it was pretty wild
48:00 it’s your hurricane Harvey um and
48:02 actually quick question did you guys
48:03 coin the term lamping no I cannot take
48:07 credit for that I don’t know where it
48:09 came from but um it was already in use
48:12 by the time that we started our business
48:14 okay all right Sarah so what is your
48:16 favorite business tool or any any type
48:18 of tool or resource that you like to use
48:21 well it’s not really a business tool um
48:25 but I have discovered in the last year
48:28 that cold plunging is really good for me
49:31 ah you’re one of those cold plungers
49:32 that I can do just about anything in
49:34 life that is said I would be I hate the
49:37 cold I don’t love being cold but I will
49:40 tell you there is something pretty darn
49:42 magical about getting your brain to stop
49:45 for about five minutes CU when you’re in
49:47 freezing cold water it’s like it’s like
49:50 it turns your brain it turns your brain
49:52 off like it it’s like a reset button you
49:55 can’t have all the same crazy thoughts
49:58 you were having before when you plunge
49:00 yourself into cold water and then are
49:02 gasping for breath and you have to learn
49:04 to calm yourself you have to learn to
49:07 breathe and you have to learn to be able
49:09 to sort of
49:11 find rest in the midst of quite extreme
49:15 physical distress and if you can do that
49:18 in cold water the trick then is you can
49:21 do it out of cold water right and that’s
49:24 what’s magical about that for me it
49:25 teaches you how to reset yourself on a
49:30 daily basis without the cold water but
50:33 it’s it’s an amazing tool for re for a
50:35 reset I should give it a fair chance
50:37 because I’m the guy that takes you know
50:39 if it’s a cold pool everybody would be
50:40 swimming and I need about 20 minutes to
50:42 slowly get like another inch another
50:44 inch another inch I am you I am you I’m
50:46 telling you I was you but I also love I
50:49 really love being able to turn a crazy
50:52 like very busy brain off and and
50:57 some well and most of us need right
50:59 that’s the reality most of us who are go
50:01 go go go go always got a million things
50:03 on the agenda stress can like build up
50:06 build up build up it’s it’s an amazing
50:09 tool for me to just find some silence
50:14 and some peace and some rest and
50:17 actually that internally is is very
50:21 healthy for
50:22 us Sarah thank you so much for being on
50:25 the show and maybe one last thing any
50:26 last parting word of a wisdm for our
50:29 listeners oh think bigger ladies and
51:32 gentlemen don’t hold back because your
51:36 dreams could just change the world thank
51:39 you very much incredible advice Sarah
51:41 thank you appreciate it
51:43 pleasure thank you for listening to the
51:45 m&a Launchpad podcast if you’ve enjoyed
51:47 today’s podcast and would like to
51:49 support us please leave us a rating and
51:50 a review after you listen I’m Casey mchu
51:52 and I look forward to talking with you
51:54 next week
