In this episode, our guest Shawn Allard shares his recent experience acquiring Novel Ice Cream in Phoenix, AZ. Despite initial reservations about entering the food & beverage industry, Shawn’s journey illustrates the value of seizing lucrative opportunities and approaching each business on its individual merits.
In this podcast episode, we discuss:
Importance of Branding and Marketing for SMB
- Shawn emphasizes the significance of branding and marketing in the success of a small business, shedding light on the local brand awareness and loyal customer base that set Novel Ice Cream apart.
Overcoming Analysis Paralysis
- The conversation delves into the mindset of a first-time acquirer, highlighting the need to avoid overthinking and take decisive action when pursuing business opportunities.
Working with and Vetting Sellers
- Shawn provides insights into the process of working with and vetting sellers, offering valuable advice for individuals entering the world of mergers and acquisitions.
Personal Guarantees in M&A
- The episode touches upon the topic of personal guarantees in mergers and acquisitions, providing a nuanced perspective on this aspect of business transactions.
Scaling & Expansion As a First Time Acquirer
- The discussion concludes with an exploration of the potential for what expansion looks like, and his next steps of an M&A acquirer.
Join us as we delve into Shawn Allard’s insightful journey of acquiring Novel Ice Cream, uncovering valuable lessons for aspiring business owners and entrepreneurs.
You can connect with Shawn Allard Twitter: @shawnwallard
Additional Resources:
- Access our archive of video interviews on YouTube
- Checkout our upcoming Conference – https://malaunchpad.com/
- Get in touch with show hosts Casey Minshew and Feras Moussa at – info@equitylaunchpad.com
- Looking to invest in M&A opportunities or partner with an advisor to acquire, scale or sell your business? Visit Equity Launchpad
Transcript
00:00 today’s episode we had Sean Allard where
00:02 we talked about buying your first
00:04 business and in his situation he ended
00:05 up buying a ice cream shop with two
00:07 locations and really on today’s episode
00:09 we kind of talked about doing it right
00:10 how to actually take action and buy that
00:12 business branding the personal
00:13 guarantees Sellers and kind of how to
00:16 vet them and ultimately how to expand a
00:19 business so Casey what were your big
00:20 takeaways man this guy Sean just goes at
00:22 it he made it happen he didn’t spend a
00:24 long time searching he went out find the
00:27 business and then he executed on a
00:28 strategy I’m highly impressed with the
01:30 individual absolutely so tons of golden
01:32 nuggets in this one so definitely listen
01:34 stay tuned and check it
01:38 out hey everybody thank you for
01:40 listening a Launchpad today our guest is
01:43 Sean Allard from Phoenix and he’s here
01:45 to talk to us about ice cream shops and
01:47 everything we need to know from A to Z
01:49 so Sean welcome to the show thanks for
01:51 having me guys I appreciate appreciate
01:52 the opportunity and it’s a pleasure to
01:54 be here no problem excited to have you
01:56 on and so that said ice cream shop R
01:58 that’s a space that I don’t know much
01:00 about besides you know my kids asking me
01:02 for ice cream and telling me it’s their
01:04 favorite uh favorite dessert to kind of
01:06 go to so really you know tell us a
01:08 little bit how how did you get to the
01:09 ice cream shop and kind of what were
01:10 ultimately is that what we were
01:11 targeting or what was the the thought
01:13 process there yeah so uh just like
01:15 yourself had no idea uh what the
01:18 beverage space look like uh no
01:19 background in the space uh you know
01:22 obviously ice cream is part of that as
01:23 well so uh was not specifically looking
01:26 for uh anything in this uh in the retail
01:29 or food and beverage space specifically
02:31 I’ve uh I’ve been in the sales world for
02:34 about four years specifically in Dental
02:36 Consulting so helping uh similar to to
02:39 what you guys have done and what we’re
02:41 kind of teaching in general business I
02:43 was doing specifically in dentistry so
02:45 helping D Dental students excuse me and
02:48 Associates get into private practice so
02:51 that uh that was that fouryear
02:53 background and then as of January
02:55 February of uh 23 started looking for a
02:58 business to buy uh after four-year
02:00 period and came across a variety of
02:03 businesses I was pretty agnostic with
02:04 with what I was looking for and came
02:07 across everything from manufacturing to
02:09 food and beverage and after a couple
02:11 months uh searching for really anything
02:14 in the one in the one to2 million range
02:16 purchase price uh I came across this
02:18 business great numbers uh it was an
02:20 off-market opportunity that was
02:22 presented to me from a broker and uh
02:24 just got really excited uh about uh
02:27 primarily the numbers from a front end
02:29 uh and then we can obviously dig into
03:31 the business in a second but yeah was no
03:34 all right not an intent to get into the
03:35 space and we’ll dive in here on the
03:37 business so I mean but what I guess what
03:39 made you mentally say hey I’m gonna go
03:40 buy a business right most people you
03:42 know doesn’t come naturally if they
03:43 didn’t from that world right kind of
03:45 what was that shift in your head yeah so
03:48 I would say the the biggest Catalyst was
03:51 the difficulty I was having was starting
03:53 something from scratch I always knew I
03:55 wanted to do my own thing own my own
03:57 business and so over that four-year
03:59 period in Consulting I had tried a a
03:02 variety of different things such as
03:04 online stuff I was doing some inperson
03:06 rental car stuff I started rental car
03:08 business I did about two years of uh
03:11 real estate both sales and uh investing
03:15 and those things got uh you know to a
03:17 certain level and uh got some traction
03:19 but just really never got me super
03:21 excited but again I knew I wanted to to
03:23 do my own thing so um again the the next
03:27 uh kind of push was diving more into the
04:30 m&a space and as I continued to see what
04:33 was happening happening in the dental
04:35 World um I figured that there might be
04:37 an opportunity to do this in general
04:39 business I was not uh you know I always
04:42 thought it was something uh you had to
04:44 do a you or you could only do if you had
04:46 a ton of money and so the initial push
04:50 was for me to get into something of my
04:53 own um that was really it and and so
04:55 January February like I said started
04:57 looking at uh a variety of different
04:60 platforms uh came across you know your
04:02 typical sites that we can touch on in a
04:04 second but uh came across a variety of
04:06 sites and and double down on that side
04:08 of things once I read a couple books uh
04:11 connected with a few people in the space
04:13 and yeah that was the initial push so
04:15 you you selftaught how to do an
04:17 acquisition absolutely yeah I and I do
04:19 gota I do gotta ask are there any
04:20 specific books on buying ice cream shops
04:23 anything focused on that not that I’ve
04:25 seen um I’m sure there’s something on
04:27 the food and beverage space that applies
04:29 to kind of every everything in that
05:30 world but uh nothing I came across in
05:32 the ascar world so but but to answer
05:35 your question yeah I I was uh you know
05:38 self-taught if you will read a single
05:40 book uh again talked to a few people in
05:42 the space and then really did most of my
05:44 research on search fund.com Twitter a
05:47 bit on LinkedIn and just jumped in as uh
05:51 as I completed you know maybe a month or
05:54 so of of general research and and
05:56 education I love that because it’s all
05:58 about making it happen right I mean we
05:00 can read all these books we can listen
05:02 to all these podcasts but at some point
05:04 you have to jump you’ve got to do it
05:06 right and that’s that’s the power of you
05:09 know not only just doing Acquisitions
05:11 but almost anything to be a successful
05:13 entrepreneur you’ve got to go at it you
05:15 got to take the risk right so how did
05:17 you look at obviously you didn’t
05:20 understand financing or maybe you had a
05:22 little bit of background of financing
05:23 but when you were going through that
05:24 process of okay now I found the business
05:27 and now I’ve got to close on the
05:29 business was that like a whole learning
06:31 curve for you that just was like oh my
06:33 God or did it all make sense going
06:35 through the process yeah so definitely
06:38 wasn’t straightforward um I knew what I
06:40 was getting into just because of my
06:42 background in the dental space so I’ve
06:44 seen how trans transactions unfolded um
06:47 so you know there’s a similar structure
06:49 there in any business that you’re
06:51 acquired whether it’s you know ice cream
06:53 or or a dental PR so there’s some
06:55 similarities there but I went the SBA
06:57 route versus uh you know a Traditional
06:59 Bank a Commercial Bank where you uh in
06:02 the demo space so the process was very
06:05 foreign to me um and again like you said
06:07 just diving into it full speed was the
06:11 really the only option I had you know I
06:14 could read a ton on the SBA I could sit
06:16 down and and connect with a ton of
06:17 bankers and and kind of outline what the
06:20 process could look like um but at the
06:22 end of the day I had to go through a
06:23 transaction to really understand what
06:25 this looks like um and once I nailed
06:28 down that price point once I nailed down
06:30 the business um it was just a matter of
07:32 connecting with as many bankers and
07:34 lenders as I could to uh understand what
07:36 was needed to begin the process um what
07:39 they needed from me financially um how I
07:43 could even get that 10% to to 20% down
07:46 so you will not understand what a
07:49 transaction looks like or how to go
07:50 through that that process without you
07:53 know actually submitting documents
07:55 sitting down with bankers and lenders
07:56 and and going through it no absolutely
07:59 and I think you know for those listening
07:00 right so SBA small business
07:01 administration they do have a really
07:03 good program for buying your own
07:04 business and you know you do got to
07:06 understand the financing you’re going to
07:08 do before you go buy business because
07:09 that will help tailor what you’re
07:10 looking for right I know Casey you have
07:12 obviously a lending kind of Commercial
07:13 Banking background and you know for
07:15 people right to understand like SBA is
07:17 really attractive for a lot of reasons
07:19 right now you do have to sign on the no
07:20 you are liable for essentially if the
07:22 thing doesn’t perform and so there’s
07:23 risk associated with it but it’s a
07:25 really attractive loan and so you know
07:27 from your side Sean I think it sounds
07:29 like right you mentioned one to two
08:30 million obviously you were specifically
08:32 saying hey I’m going to go buy a
08:33 business it’s going to be with the SBA
08:34 and that’s the bucket that I’m I’m going
08:35 to go Define right yep exactly so I knew
08:38 my price point based on what I could
08:40 personally afford with 10% down and uh
08:43 some injection from friends and family
08:45 so I knew that that was the ideal price
08:47 point once I identified that obviously
08:49 there was some constraints I needed to
08:51 sit around with my search uh but that’s
08:53 what I also took to my bank uh excuse me
08:55 my lender and they also identified some
08:59 uh some of the industries that make more
08:00 sense for my price point what I was
08:03 willing to put down uh obviously every
08:05 bank is different in what they’re
08:06 willing to to finance um industry-wise
08:09 so you know some banks are definitely
08:11 not going to work in the restaurant
08:12 space or the food and beverage space so
08:14 um yeah very dependent so how did you
08:16 handle and this is always that big
08:17 question right anybody that’s listening
08:20 it’s like okay great SBA 90 you can do
08:23 90% financing I could put 10% down but
08:26 then how did you face the personal
08:27 guarantee how do I mean like right like
09:30 everybody’s got to overcome at some
09:32 point where they’re like oh this is all
09:33 great but now I got to put it all on the
09:35 line so how did you take that how did
09:37 you deal with that yeah I mean once once
09:39 I identified that SBA was the most
09:42 straightforward path for me I didn’t
09:44 have to bring out investors I didn’t
09:45 need to raise capital I didn’t need to
09:47 you know give up equity in in any sense
09:49 of the word so other than just kind of
09:52 stomaching it I I don’t really have a
09:54 magic pill for the fact that it was sort
09:56 of the only option it was it was like
09:58 okay do I do I go all in bu this
09:01 business or or not uh because this is is
09:04 the only option that I have if I want to
09:07 go this route Alone um obviously I could
09:10 bring on partners and they could
09:11 potentially take on that personal
09:13 guarantee but again it’s it it wasn’t
09:15 something I was willing to do I wanted
09:16 to get in the game um and learn this on
09:18 my own and and take this first
09:20 transaction as a learning opportunity
09:23 and for me to do that I had to sort of I
09:25 really just had to put it all on the
09:26 line yeah so so one one word confidence
09:30 no I absolutely admire that because you
10:32 know one of the things we do here at
10:33 Equity Launchpad and on on our program
10:35 is to back entrepreneurs that are
10:37 looking to buy a business right maybe
10:39 they had they need a partner and the
10:41 number one conversation we deal with is
10:44 who’s going to sign the personal
10:45 guarantee right it’s like everybody
10:47 wants you have they all want what you
10:49 have they want the returns they want it
10:51 all but then you get the the documents
10:53 and everybody goes you mean I got to put
10:55 it all on the line you’re like yes
10:58 absolutely and it’s not it’s not a free
10:60 ride so so so really quick just to kind
10:02 of recap for the audience right so you
10:03 did an SBA loan sounds like you levered
10:05 up to 90% right so that remaining 10%
10:07 you brought between your money and
10:09 friends right and it sounds like those
10:11 friends really loaned you the money they
10:13 didn’t even buy into the business right
10:14 it was obviously you worked out an
10:15 arrangement but you are the solo owner
10:17 of that business correct yeah friends
10:20 and nice awesome and so and I do have to
10:23 ask so once you defined your criteria I
10:25 don’t think you initially said I’m going
10:26 to buy a one to2 million ice cream
10:28 business right you’re guessing you were
11:30 pretty Broad and then the ice cream
11:31 business kind of came its way exactly so
11:34 it took about two months to fall on uh
11:36 this opportunity but again you you you
11:39 get into the space with a very similar
11:41 mindset that that everybody else does in
11:43 the one to let’s say $5 million range
11:46 you know something sustainable it’s been
11:47 around for 20 30 40 years um lot of
11:51 opportunity for growth just kind of
11:52 running you know anciently if you will
11:55 and so you know I kind of took that
11:57 blueprint to heart um based on what I
11:59 was seeing in the in the m&a world and
11:03 and looked at things from manufacturing
11:05 to suppliers I mean just just about
11:09 anything other than the food and
11:10 beverage space that was really the the
11:13 only criteria I didn’t have uh I was
11:15 willing to go that route but it was more
11:18 based on the conversations I was having
11:19 in the space and um learning from others
11:22 who had gone down the restaurant or food
11:24 and beverage space you know you hear all
11:26 the horror stories and so uh contined to
11:28 get pushed away from it but this
11:30 opportunity got presented to me based on
12:32 the conversations I was having with that
12:33 specific broker um the numbers just made
12:37 sense um there was clear opportunity for
12:40 growth um it hadn’t been around for 20
12:42 years but it had been very stable for
12:45 close to
12:46 five and uh you know so owner T of
12:49 opportunity for growth and and so
12:51 although it wasn’t the original plan uh
12:54 you know it made sense financially and I
12:57 felt like it was a simple enough
12:59 business to understand and that I can
12:01 plug in on day one and actually you know
12:03 make a change and push and I do got to
12:06 ask so have you have you heard of the
12:07 food that built America I have not it’s
12:09 an awesome TV series I highly recommend
12:12 they probably have 40 50 episodes and
12:14 basically they talk about all of the
12:15 brands that are familiar to us all right
12:17 from the General Mills to the post to
12:20 anything and everything foodwise and
12:22 really how they all came about right
12:24 like you know like knowing Dave Thomas
12:26 from Wendy’s really used to be kind of
12:28 the main guy at FC right all of the and
13:30 so they did a really good episode on all
13:32 the ice cream brands so I highly
13:33 recommend that one because you can
13:34 really start to understand it’s pretty
13:36 cool ice cream you know was an invention
13:37 and there’s actually a lot of innovation
13:39 in a space that’s you know like you said
13:41 been around for a while and so highly
13:42 recommend that or the listeners to check
13:44 out if they hadn’t had a chance but I
13:46 guess going back to the business so you
13:47 closed on the business right day one
13:49 showed up what’ you
13:51 do that is a a great question so you
13:54 didn’t kick your feet up on the desk and
13:55 say hey I I’m the I’m the new guy
13:57 sheriff in town new sheriff in town no
13:59 so uh luckily I had a great a great
13:02 seller the transition was fairly smooth
13:04 obviously we we’ll go into the the ups
13:06 and downs in the first couple weeks or
13:07 so but um the first I would say week was
13:12 really sitting down with all the
13:13 employees um you know getting clear on
13:16 where I wanted to take things and just
13:19 getting a a good understanding of how
13:20 the business actually operated so being
13:22 in the shops working alongside the team
13:25 members uh and just learning more about
13:27 them individually um and I could have
13:29 done a way better job of that looking
14:31 back um I was very focused on you know
14:34 kind of pulling all the levers I
14:36 identified when I first started you know
14:38 going down the the purchase process I I
14:41 I really tried to pull all those levers
14:43 immediately versus just taking a step
14:45 back and and actually getting in the
14:46 Shops and and uh seeing what was working
14:50 and wasn’t working versus trying to you
14:52 know fix things from AF far without
14:54 actually operating it with my own hands
14:56 so you know it was a mix of things uh
14:58 being in the shops for a few days here
14:59 and there throughout the first couple
14:00 weeks um obviously a ton of transitional
14:02 things uh with me and the seller and
14:04 then sitting down with our um you know
14:07 with any of our vendors and and
14:08 understanding how that process worked
14:10 and just getting uh very deep into how
14:15 you actually operates a quote unquote
14:17 restaurant you know again the the food
14:18 and beverage space is very similar
14:20 depending no matter if you’re in a
14:21 fullscale restaurant or ice cream
14:23 there’s you know it’s inventory people
14:25 and customer service there’s there’s not
14:27 much more so uh just really
14:30 understanding how to operate a retail
15:32 business was key for me so the first
15:34 couple weeks was was just getting my
15:35 hands dirty with that yeah and quick
15:37 question we forgot to ask why was the
15:39 seller selling so he was a young guy uh
15:41 wasn’t because he was looking to retire
15:43 he was about 35 just recently had uh kid
15:46 he was looking to spend more time with
15:48 and he he’d been working on the business
15:50 for about five years and I think he just
15:53 felt like it was the right time to give
15:57 it up to somebody who was willing to
15:59 take it to them the next level he liked
15:01 the two to maybe three shop uh Max
15:04 lifestyle business that you know he
15:06 could operate a few hours a week had a
15:08 great team around him could really be
15:09 present uh with everybody in the shops
15:12 and just again have more of a lifestyle
15:14 business that wasn’t requiring 40 50 60
15:17 hours a week um and I think he set it up
15:19 you know perfectly for himself to do
15:20 that and really set me up for Success um
15:24 going into it given that if I wanted to
15:27 keep this business the same I could I
15:29 could work 5 10 maybe 15 hours a week
16:32 Max um but again it’s it it was it was
16:35 built as a lifestyle business with um
16:39 with growth in mind it just never got to
16:41 that point with uh with the current
16:43 seller or the current so did you find
16:45 did you find so when you when you guys
16:47 closed how many locations were there two
16:50 two locations how many employees uh 20
16:53 20 and today have you have you been able
16:56 to expand from those two shops today so
16:58 we’re working so we’re about 5 months in
16:01 we’re two and a halfish months from our
16:03 third shop and fourth shop congrats
16:06 shops in Arizona that we’re working on
16:08 now uh we’ll probably get up to 30
16:11 employees at that time by March or April
16:13 of of this year and then uh we have a
16:16 few out of state locations that we’re
16:18 working on so I’ve actually taken a
16:19 different approach um than I originally
16:22 had in mind with just going retail heavy
16:25 uh we’re looking at potentially trailers
16:27 trucks uh popups just a variety of
16:30 different things so that that will make
17:32 it easier for us to scale to you know
17:34 five six seven locations maybe even by
17:36 by the end of this here very nice 20
17:39 location excuse me 20 people when I
17:40 bought and uh two locations yeah and and
17:43 really quick right going back to the
17:44 seller I mean some people just get
17:46 tunnel vision right they get complacent
17:47 they’re have comfortable in life and
17:49 they can’t see you know the expansion
17:51 opportunities or how to get themselves
17:52 out of it so they can work on the
17:54 business and I think my question for you
17:55 is ultimately how much time do you find
17:57 yourself you know in the ice cream shop
17:59 working in the business versus how much
17:01 time are you able to sit back and
17:02 strategically plan out hey how we going
17:04 to go from you know 2 to 5 to 7 to 10
17:07 yeah right are you able to step out of
17:08 it entirely and really focus on that
17:10 strategy side or you still feel like you
17:12 get pulled back in because ultimately
17:14 with any business right what makes I
17:15 think you know any business whether
17:17 you’re real estate or kind of Hands-On
17:19 retail business right operations you
17:21 know that’s where you kind of live and
17:22 breathe and you always get sucked back
17:24 into it so how’s it kind of gone so far
17:26 100% I I couldn’t agree more so I got
17:29 lucky with two great managers when I
18:31 came in and so they were handling
18:33 everything from scheduling to inventory
18:35 management to purchasing so a lot of my
18:38 time was spent transitioning um and kind
18:41 of consolidating the day-to-day things
18:43 that the the seller was working on so a
18:45 lot of it was you this is going to sound
18:47 crazy but most of the businesses run off
18:49 of Google Sheets so it’s just
18:50 consolidating 20 sheets into maybe one
18:53 right just TR kind of having a master
18:55 you know operations uh you know playbook
18:58 in in in one spot that so a lot of a lot
18:02 of time was was go ahead sorry I was
18:04 gonna say I previously worked at
18:06 Microsoft and K from the tech world and
18:07 the number one competitor for almost
18:09 every software product is Excel so don’t
18:11 feel bad Excel everybody starts there
18:14 and goes as far as they can until they
18:16 can’t so yeah and and it doesn’t need to
18:18 be complex right we still operate off of
18:20 Google Sheets and we’ll continue to
18:22 operate off of Google Sheets for you
18:23 know probably up to 10 vations so but to
18:26 answer your question about being in the
18:28 shops um being you know kind of
19:30 day-to-day there no I have been in the
19:33 shops four to five times Max and three
19:38 to four out of those times maybe yeah
19:40 three to four of those times uh have
19:42 been you know me wanting to learn more
19:44 about the business and actually you know
19:46 work alongside the team one of those
19:49 times has been out of necessity um
19:51 because there were a lot of changes in
19:53 the first two three months that were
19:55 being made and so uh yeah one time was
19:58 that a necessity so the last two months
19:01 not necessary at all I’ve been
19:02 completely focused on expansion cleaning
19:05 up operations hiring um reorganizing the
19:10 the team and you know kind of bringing
19:12 some new managers and play uh and yeah
19:15 kind of restructuring the management
19:16 team no that’s that’s awesome and you be
19:18 able to avoid the pitfalls right like I
19:19 said the emth Revisited if anyone hasn’t
19:21 read that book it just really focuses on
19:23 most people end up working in the
19:25 business than on the business right and
19:27 that’s what scares people from a bakery
19:29 or or retail or anything like that so
20:30 that’s awesome that kind of you can see
20:31 that just in your strategy right you’re
20:33 you’re not that far into it yet you’re
20:35 already working on the next one and
20:36 multiple way so that’s good so when you
20:38 came into it I take it you had that was
20:40 part of your vision right you’re you’re
20:41 sitting here to say hey look I’m gonna
20:43 buy this and I’m gonna I’m gonna scale
20:44 it I’m gonna expand so kind of touch
20:47 about on that like in my mind it’s
20:49 almost like are you gonna go out and buy
20:51 other ice cream shops or are you gonna
20:53 sit there and go I’m going to grow
20:54 organically I mean what are those
20:55 strategies what did it look like on your
20:57 plan yeah so plan is definitely to to
20:59 expand uh the initial you know if you’re
20:02 looking at any retail food and beverage
20:03 space the easiest Playbook is just more
20:05 locations right so that was you know
20:07 without about the space my plan was cool
20:09 open more locations get to 12 120 years
20:12 doesn’t matter how long it takes but you
20:13 know that’s where we’re going to get to
20:15 so the ultimate Vision was just opening
20:17 shops Nationwide um and then obviously
20:20 starting in Arizona get to get to a
20:22 sustainable place here and then you know
20:24 continue to scale in the west coast and
20:25 Beyond but um the the opportunity is
20:29 always there to acquire existing shops
21:31 that or maybe Mom and Pop shops around
21:32 the country that aren’t doing very very
21:34 well and and so we can Rebrand those
21:37 shops um which which I’m definitely open
21:39 to if that opportunity has come up once
21:41 or twice numbers just didn’t make sense
21:43 for us the of um the beauty of what we
21:47 do and how we operate is everything is
21:49 is out of window service so we’re only
21:51 five to our shops are only five to 700
21:53 Square fet so it’s uh one it’s very
21:56 tough to find in traditional retail and
21:58 any of of the existing shops are
21:00 typically 1,200 to 1500 plus square feet
21:05 um so for us to build out that space and
21:07 and actually utilize it a little bit
21:09 more expensive uh than we really need to
21:11 to get so the the playbooks a little
21:14 slower for us because we’re trying to
21:16 find spaces that are really unique maybe
21:18 even oneoff you know single buildings
21:20 that aren’t in traditional retail spaces
21:23 strip malls normal malls and so yeah we
21:27 have to be pretty picky with with what
21:29 we’re looking for but the the plan is
22:31 definitely to acquire existing shops if
22:33 they if those come up that’s awesome
22:35 yeah so then I guess you know let’s
22:37 shift gears so let’s talk about the
22:38 brand right you’re in a competitive
22:40 space you’re in retail what is that
22:42 differentiation Factor that’s going to
22:44 and how much time do you spend thinking
22:45 about your brand and kind of that
22:47 messaging right because I think the
22:48 companies that grow are the ones that
22:50 nail that right and then from then on
22:52 everything is built around that yeah so
22:54 I spent a lot of time thinking about how
22:57 we’re going to
22:59 hold this level of or this standard and
22:03 this brand as we go into other states I
22:07 think it’s fairly easy to hold or
22:10 sustain what we’re doing in Arizona just
22:12 because we’ve been here for six years
22:13 we’re very well known so any location I
22:15 open up um fairly straightforward right
22:17 people people know we have a presence
22:19 here so um but jumping into new markets
22:22 is always tough so I spent a lot of time
22:24 thinking about how we’re going to enter
22:26 new markets how we’re going to approach
22:27 other uh brands
22:29 um how we can work with other brands in
23:31 the coffee space or restaurant space to
23:33 to kind of work in tandem with them to
23:35 to to build a uh culture or brand in
23:38 those other states so U the
23:40 differentiator for us is is two things
23:43 one uh we’re one our locations are very
23:46 different so from a you know from a
23:49 visual perspective we just look very
23:52 different we’re not in traditional
23:53 retail um we’re not a we’re not yet a
23:56 nostalgic like Legacy sort of brand so
23:58 we’re
23:59 stale if you will there there’s a lot of
23:02 there’s a lot of u fun and and like
23:04 uniqueness that we’re bringing into
23:06 flavors and social media and uh just our
23:11 approach in in in approaching our
23:13 customers and and how we work with them
23:14 so there there’s a variety of ways that
23:16 we stand out but biggest piece is uh
23:21 what are our locations nice now I heard
23:24 that uh on on the other podcast I was
23:25 listening to now is there like a
23:27 doughnut type product that you have is
23:29 there something that’s like kind of like
23:30 your leading piece that makes y all very
24:32 unique yeah so I love donuts I
24:35 mean ice cream I’ve been on keto and the
24:38 biggest barrier is not eating donuts and
24:40 not eating ice cream so no kidding yeah
24:43 oh my God yeah brutal so our our quot
24:46 product is an ice cream stuffed donut so
24:49 that is our biggest differentiator
24:51 obviously we have your traditional cones
24:53 cups floats and everything in between
24:56 but what we’re known for specifically in
24:59 Phoenix uh our original shop is is our
24:01 ice cream stuff donut so um that’s what
24:04 we promote that’s what we’re known for
24:06 um and sounds like Kevin yeah it’s uh
24:09 it’s incredible you got you gota I’ve
24:11 gained a few pounds um since August I’ll
24:14 tell you that for
24:15 sure all right you know it’s I so one of
24:18 the first businesses I got into out of
24:20 college um I started a bar you know I I
24:23 got a couple guys together we opened a
24:25 bar we lived in Austin it was on six
24:26 Street we thought hey man we’re gonna
24:27 make a killing but the problem was is
24:30 that you know if you drink and you drink
25:32 consume alcohol and you’re in that
25:34 business you find that every single
25:36 night in that business is a party right
25:38 it’s like man so it’s hard sometimes to
25:40 to monetize that and make M working in
25:42 the business not on the business Cas in
25:43 the business right so I would imagine
25:45 you’ve got to be careful like not to
25:47 grab a doughnut ice cream every day
25:50 every day like that for a few months I
25:52 will tell you like anytime I was in our
25:54 our distribution center it was I was
25:57 working alongside all of it so it was uh
25:59 it was a daily thing for sure I’m
25:02 actually curious how did that bar go and
25:04 where what happened with that oh man it
25:06 was a disaster
25:08 uh guys running a bar like as the
25:11 business sounds down to you I tell you
25:13 it was so much fun but you know when we
25:15 go back to those personal guarantees you
25:17 know even though I’m not personally
25:18 guarantee the loan because we did a lot
25:20 of cash and did those kind of things you
25:22 know you got to sign for the ice machine
25:24 you got to sign for the credit card
25:25 thing I mean everything you had to sign
25:27 for and so it was one of the best
25:29 learning experiences I chose not to go
26:32 you know after I graduated college I
26:33 chose not to go to get my NBA or do any
26:36 of those things I took that cash and I
26:38 went and opened up a business and I’ll
26:40 tell you it was the best NBA I’ve ever
26:42 had man I learned everything not to do
26:44 in a business which sometimes is is the
26:46 best right School of Hard Knock is the
26:48 best school of all oh it’s a tough did
26:50 you guys shut that business down or you
26:51 all end up just giving it away or no we
26:54 you know I I tried to get it sold I I
26:56 had a couple guys that you know that
26:57 were interested in our model and what we
26:59 were doing but we had no business plan
26:01 we had no like expansion I mean it was
26:04 just truly like I did not like my
26:07 day-to-day job I was like I graduated I
26:09 got a job and I was like there is no way
26:11 that I’m going to do this for the rest
26:12 of my life I’m not and uh I was like we
26:15 got to do something I can relate to that
26:17 that was you know if if we’re summing it
26:19 up in one sentence then that’s probably
26:21 why I got into it and most people
26:24 listening are W are also wanting to get
26:27 into this space so I guess kind of you
26:29 know going through so you’re in the kind
27:31 of expansion mode right now right how
27:32 are you going to fund those expansions
27:34 right how did you decide on it is it
27:36 like I said I think your guys are G to
27:38 keep it all corporate right you didn’t
27:39 go down the franchise model what was the
27:41 thinking behind that and then ultimately
27:43 how are you gonna is it going to be more
27:44 SBA Loans until you kind of Hit the max
27:46 or do you have some other strategy yeah
27:48 so it’ll be a mixture of a few things I
27:50 mean to to jump on the the franchise
27:52 piece really quick simply said I just
27:54 wanted to control every aspect of it for
27:56 you know for for the long run um I it
27:59 something might change in 10 20 30 years
27:01 from now but for for now I really want
27:05 to H have my hands on every piece of the
27:08 puzzle um obviously build a great team
27:10 around me to to support me but uh I I
27:14 just really want to have full control
27:16 over the brand messaging approach
27:18 customer service I I just really want to
27:21 double down on perfecting the model and
27:24 so um nothing against franchising it
27:26 just I don’t think it fits our brand um
27:30 as well as it could so yeah keeping it
28:32 corporate um but again things might
28:35 change in 20 years from now um and then
28:38 to fund expansion there’s really two
28:41 ways we can approach it for something
28:43 like a truck for example that we’re
28:44 looking at in uh in Arizona we’re we’re
28:48 probably going to finance a piece of
28:50 that uh but for our locations if there
28:52 existing builds and we don’t have to do
28:54 a ton inside let’s say they were
28:56 previous coffee shops ice cream shops
28:58 any food and beverage spot um our builds
28:00 are anywhere from 25 to 35k so very very
28:05 oh nice oh that’s we can we can use most
28:08 of our we can just use cash for those uh
28:11 but something you know a larger scale uh
28:14 if we are building something from
28:15 scratch or we’re building a trailer like
28:17 we’re working on now or uh our truck um
28:20 those are more in the 80 to $100,000
28:23 range uh Again full build outs we will
28:26 put some cash down and and utilize some
28:28 Finance as well if SBA is is available
29:30 to me uh at better interest rates I’ll
29:33 definitely utilize that but uh more than
29:37 likely we’ll go private funding or uh
29:40 eventually raise some Capital if if we
29:42 need to to to Contin at the current spba
29:44 rates it’s probably better to go find
29:46 you know try to find some some interest
29:48 rate Capital it’s a little bit different
29:49 and it’s probably trading right around
29:50 private Capital anyways right exactly
29:53 yeah and as you get to that point let’s
29:54 definitely have a conversation if you’re
29:56 looking for ways to expand you got of
29:59 explore that um and it’s and it’s funny
29:02 you say so so kind of the truck router
29:04 everybody Associates trucks with kind of
29:05 low cost but from your side it’s it’s
29:08 the opposite right that food truck that
29:10 yeah there’s a lot three three locations
29:12 for that one right yeah people would be
29:15 surprised that the if obviously you
29:17 could find trucks used trucks you know
29:19 that are pretty beat up for 10 20,000
29:21 you can maybe put 20 to 30,000 into it
29:23 so you’re about 50 grand out of pocket
29:26 um but if you want a good you know at
29:28 least a a reliable truck and you want
30:31 the you want the thing to look halfway
30:32 decent you’re you’re you’re going to put
30:34 at least 80 grand into it yeah I mean
30:37 quality right I mean you guys are you
30:38 guys have tremendous good reviews and
30:40 you have to continue to maintain that
30:42 image regardless of whether it’s a truck
30:43 or if it’s a physical store but you know
30:45 for the people that are listening and
30:46 you think about trucks and you start
30:48 thinking about the expansion not only
30:49 that now you’ve got your general
30:51 liability those costs go up right the
30:53 workers comp for the driver that you’re
30:54 actually driving it’s there’s a lot to
30:56 put into that consideration right so
30:59 uh it also brings on a whole another
30:00 level to the business that maybe you’re
30:02 not you haven’t been thinking about in
30:03 the past absolutely yeah there’s a lot
30:05 more risk a lot more Capital involved
30:07 events catering I mean there’s a whole
30:09 there’s a whole another ball game there
30:11 um that we’re exploring we’ve done a
30:12 handful of those things already um just
30:14 identifying the the risk versus reward
30:17 there but I think it’s it’s really it’s
30:19 really worth the awareness that comes
30:21 with with those kind of mobile setups so
30:24 yeah awesome the one question I had
30:26 before we move on to kind of our rocket
30:28 round which is you said we a few times
30:30 who is we is it just you do you have a
31:32 couple of key members of the team that’s
31:33 kind of helping you make the day-to-day
31:35 and implementing that division or what’s
31:36 that look like on the corporate side
31:38 yeah on the corporate side it’s simply
31:39 me um obviously I have two managers but
31:42 from a like high level leadership
31:45 perspective it’s really just me on our
31:46 day-to-day working all all these
31:47 projects and luckily I have that in shop
31:52 support um but everything else as far as
31:55 expansion build outs um you know
31:58 branding anything like that that’s
31:60 that’s a loty what what I like is he
31:01 says we because it’s because there what
31:04 do they say there’s no I in team in
31:06 that’s a beautiful part of what you’re
31:07 doing man it’s it’s about your it’s
31:08 about your team yeah this would not
31:10 exist obviously with no and that’s gonna
31:13 grow right you’re approaching that
31:14 critical point where you start to have
31:15 to think about all of the auxiliary
31:17 things that are not quar to a business
31:20 right and it’s funny so our model is
31:22 really providing that as a backbone to
31:23 businesses that we have and it’s really
31:25 that sales marketing HR it accounting
31:27 and legal those are are all things that
31:29 are kind of on the outside of a business
32:30 outside of the the core of what it is
32:33 you provide and how you provide it and
32:34 and you know I love what you’re doing I
32:36 mean definitely have a vision there and
32:37 I think you’re going to start to hit
32:38 some of those start to have to spend
32:39 more time and think of those and have
32:41 people that are goingon to take on some
32:41 of those responsibilities and kind of
32:42 grow that back office right now
32:44 everything you just mentioned like
32:46 that’s that’s song shop right legal
32:49 payroll hiring firing manage I mean for
32:52 outside of the shops it’s shown so I
32:55 will look for support at some point uh
32:58 once we get to four locations I think I
32:60 will reach a capacity that uh you know
32:03 that that will be a lot it will be more
32:05 tough for me to continue to focus on
32:07 scaling so we we’ll probably bring one
32:11 or two more people on board from a
32:12 leadership standpoint that point so I’ve
32:15 got one little quick question here so
32:16 have you found that moment yet where
32:17 you’re like when you look in the mirror
32:19 you’re like hey my I am now Su my
32:21 business is successful or do you feel
32:23 like you’ve got a ways to go to where
32:25 you look at yourself and say Matt we’re
32:27 success yeah that is uh that that I
33:30 don’t know if that will ever happen to
33:31 be honest with you that’s that more of a
33:33 personal problem
33:35 but I have oh I feel the pain trust me I
33:39 I I it’s it’s it’s how we are as
33:40 entrepreneurs right we can always
33:42 improve always get better it can be best
33:45 but sometimes we got to look in the
33:45 mirror and go hey I’ve accomplished a
33:48 lot you know and and pat yourself on the
33:50 back that’s that’s valuable and I think
33:52 I need to I need to spend more time
33:54 doing that uh
33:56 my yeah my my kind of default is what’s
33:59 next you know let’s keep going let’s
33:02 push forward like let’s get another
33:03 business it’s us here too no no I
33:05 literally you know my my biggest
33:06 weakness I tell my my leadership is
33:08 ultimately you know always focused on
33:10 that next problem to solve and you kind
33:12 of stop and you forget to stop and say
33:15 hey good job Casey you solved those
33:17 other 3,000 problems you know but I’m a
33:19 little older than you guys and I’m gonna
33:20 tell you right now you need to stop and
33:22 you need to Pat yourself on the back
33:23 because I’m going to tell you what this
33:24 is one hell of a journey right you know
33:27 I will tell you right now you’re success
33:28 right you you were at a workstation you
34:30 were at a desk and you said hey I’m
34:32 going to go buy a company and now you’re
34:33 opening your Visions to open four that’s
34:36 huge that’s a win right we got a short
34:38 life these these are the things we got
34:40 to celebrate absolutely well done Sean
34:42 so definitely you know thank you for
34:44 sharing that Journey definitely
34:45 appreciate it really appreciate it so
34:47 let’s move on to our rocket round so you
34:49 know I think first question right
34:51 speaking of what we’re just talking
34:52 about what you like to do in your free
34:54 time yeah so
34:56 there’s you guys will probably everybody
34:58 listening will probably relate to this
34:59 too outside of working searching for
34:02 more businesses like I have a I have a
34:04 couple potential partners that we’re
34:05 working on a few deals here just outside
34:06 of the food and beverage space and I’m
34:08 actually working on a second food and
34:10 beverage concept right next to one of
34:12 our our novel locations so um 90% of my
34:16 life is just kind of business and I I
34:19 really actually enjoy that so finding
34:21 you you know building new Concepts
34:23 buying more businesses just researching
34:26 businesses whatever it is um and then
34:30 I’m really into running in the gym
35:31 simply put you know I I running my first
35:35 marathon in a
35:37 month yeah just random like Fitness
35:40 related stuff is is the other 10% of my
35:42 life but that’s it work off those donut
35:45 I cre but I’ll tell you the other thing
35:47 about running is is that all that time
35:49 you’re you’re working your business plan
35:51 I know you are you know you’re listening
35:53 to music you’re thinking through every
35:55 process it’s one of the best things man
35:56 I run too said the answer day which is
35:58 we’re kind of Adrenaline Junkies with
35:60 the businesses and just kind thinking
35:01 what’s next and doing that while you’re
35:03 exercising usually is not a bad idea
35:05 that’s why I like flying because I
35:06 flying it forces me to think about the
35:08 airplane and I ignore everything else in
35:09 life and so luckily nothing’s moving
35:12 under me so I can just I can go straight
35:14 for two hours and and not have to think
35:15 about much but yeah that’s definitely a
35:17 time to reflect and and sit back and
35:20 like kind of remove myself from the
35:21 dayto day and and a lot of you know a
35:24 lot of what I’m working on comes from
35:26 the time I spend outside of the business
35:28 right whether it’s in the gym it’s 12:00
36:30 at night not able to sleep just laying
36:32 there staring at the you know staring at
36:34 the wall all the all the ideas flood in
36:36 the moments where you are actually like
36:38 taking a like taking a step back
36:40 intentionally so uh yeah that that helps
36:43 what pretty crazy is I’ve had two things
36:45 pop up that I was running on two years
36:47 ago and I could I had this repetitive
36:50 like process where I just kept beating
36:51 it up beating it up beating it up and
36:54 and both of them have come true so but I
36:56 thought through everything while I was
36:57 running and then I thought through my
36:59 execution it took two years but then bam
36:01 Casey’s not the fastest thinker but you
36:03 know no it’s not no I I’m
36:05 pondering awesome all right so let’s
36:08 move on to the second question so what’s
36:10 been your most favor or most memorable
36:13 business moment I really think just
36:16 buying the business or closing on the
36:17 business was the most memorable moment
36:19 because that has completely changed my
36:22 life in incredible ways I mean just the
36:26 trust I have from other people even
36:29 though I have no idea what I’m doing
36:30 like let’s be honest right I’m figuring
37:31 it out every day but we all stumble
37:34 forward right just closing on one
37:36 transaction has opened my world up to so
37:39 many
37:40 opportunities uh from other partners
37:42 Founders investors like I I I mean the
37:45 the concept I’m working on now with
37:46 another partner would have never come up
37:48 if I didn’t have the credibility of at
37:51 least one transaction right
37:53 so yeah that that has completely changed
37:56 my life in in many over so that that I
37:59 think was the most memorable moment even
37:01 though in the moment um I was like crap
37:04 I you know I’ve got to go to work
37:06 tomorrow and learn how to run a you know
37:09 learn how to run a retail business so in
37:11 the moment it was not excitement it was
37:13 like oh we did this like let’s let’s
37:15 double down and figure this out it was
37:17 you know what’s crazy is so we we we
37:19 recently went to the uh ETA conference
37:21 in Harvard I I’ve been there twice we
37:23 like going to the conferences we did the
37:25 rice conference here and we stumble
37:27 across entrepreneur ERS that have been
37:28 searching for like 18 months 24 months
38:32 because they’re just trying to fit into
38:33 this like perfect box of a deal and then
38:36 you for two months closed your business
38:39 and now you’re expanding by the time
38:41 many of these guys are still searching
38:44 right it’s pretty powerful man I’m
38:45 curious to see where you’re at in 18
38:47 months let’s get to 18 locations in 18
38:49 months all right that’s the next podcast
38:50 we’ll do with you don’t
38:52 over that would be the ideal but as as
38:56 fast as we can go but to to on that
38:58 really quick I you know
38:00 obviously my criteria was a lot less
38:03 strict I think than most people but to
38:06 be honest uh you’re never going to find
38:08 the perfect business so sitting there
38:10 for 18 24 months trying to find the
38:12 perfect business is it it probably will
38:15 never happen um you you have to be okay
38:18 with a high level of
38:20 uncertainty and um I think what people
38:24 get stuck on is the lack of knowledge in
38:26 a certain industry too so they may come
38:28 across a really good business great
38:30 financials great opportunity but they
39:32 don’t understand the business so they
39:33 don’t know how to they don’t come from
39:35 that background um and and so the the
39:39 people I’ve connected with in the past
39:41 six or to to seven months that have
39:43 gotten into this space with little to no
39:46 knowledge of their
39:47 industry um have closed quickly because
39:51 you know they they didn’t over think the
39:52 process they knew that they could learn
39:54 um as they go and the beauty of
39:57 acquiring versus is starting is that you
39:59 don’t have to know all the answers
39:00 because the business is already working
39:02 so even if you don’t if you go in there
39:04 and don’t change anything things will
39:06 stay the same or should stay the same so
39:09 you huge
39:10 advice a year right absolutely I mean
39:14 it’s about finding something that’s good
39:15 enough right and you know being able to
39:17 work through adversity I mean you know
39:18 our last Business Week closed that thing
39:20 took a year right we thought we were
39:22 going to be closed six months prior and
39:24 you work through the challenges and the
39:25 issues and the the long night and
39:28 everything that kind of happens and you
39:29 get it to done and now you work through
40:30 the next set of challenges so that’s
40:32 that’s what being an entrepreneur is all
40:33 about knowing enough to be dangerous and
40:35 moving forward I’ll tell you one of the
40:36 fun things about Ferris and is kind of
40:38 what you’re going on I call it the ready
40:39 fire aim strategy right you know it’s
40:41 like let’s just go let’s just do it
40:44 we’ll stumble we’ll find our way but if
40:46 we don’t start now we’re never be a year
40:49 down later and realize oh we it’s been a
40:50 year since we have done anything so I
40:53 actually had the expectation of of you
40:55 know 12 to 18 months of search I mean
40:58 just that’s what I was seeing right I I
40:01 didn’t think that it was possible to
40:02 close on anything sooner than that so um
40:05 to to close on something in six months
40:07 from from beginning search is um sort of
40:10 a a blessing in a way to be honest
40:12 that’s awesome awesome and so then last
40:15 question what’s been your favorite
40:16 business tool or resource to kind of
40:18 help you in the journey this is going to
40:20 sound crazy um Twitter
40:23 has that kind of takes the cake for me I
40:26 think um I’ve learned learned 90% of
40:30 what I need to from an SBA
41:32 route um how to how to operate a
41:35 business in general um I’ve met the most
41:39 incredible people the most incredible
41:41 supporters um advisors mentors like
41:44 pretty much everything great that has
41:47 happened in the past you know six months
41:50 has come from that platform and so I it
41:53 always sounds a little crazy you are the
41:54 only person that has answered that
41:56 question that way so now you got to
41:57 edate me all right who should I be
41:58 following on Twitter to kind of help no
41:00 kid you know get in the know with what
41:02 you’re seeing out there so I would
41:04 truthfully I would have to P it up and
41:05 go through who I’m following there’s uh
41:08 hundreds I mean there there’s all right
41:11 maybe if you could email it to the team
41:12 after and we’ll put it on the show notes
41:13 for people and I will go follow those
41:15 people because I I you know you hear
41:17 that right it’s Twitter I think it’s
41:19 like a gold mine you just have to spend
41:20 the time and really mine it and people I
41:22 think you know get some real value it’s
41:23 X now so you got to change the
41:25 terminology right you’re right so I what
41:28 I’m going to do is is send you a list of
42:30 let’s say 10 of the top yeah your 10
42:32 favorite that’d be awesome that’s huge
42:34 those but yeah again it sounds crazy but
42:37 truthfully if you spend the time
42:39 connecting with others that are in your
42:41 space or others you admire in other
42:43 Industries just setting up 20 30 minutes
42:46 with with them has taught me pretty much
42:48 everything I need to know about business
42:50 and you know they’re always there as as
42:53 resources and and mentors as I go along
42:56 so yeah I’ve I’ve met some of the most
42:58 incredible people and the tools and
42:00 resources that I’ve that I’m currently
42:02 using in my business has pretty much all
42:04 come from that platform perfect well
42:07 Sean been tremendous amount of
42:08 information you know really appreciate
42:10 you just being candid and honest with us
42:11 right and sharing what you know I think
42:13 listeners probably you know 35 nuggets
42:16 shared throughout that and so we’ll
42:17 definitely capture those but really
42:19 appreciate you taking the time to kind
42:20 of talk to us today Sean but I’ll tell
42:22 you man one of one of those things that
42:23 you said man right there I take it this
42:25 is my takeaway from you like do it like
42:28 go like Don’t overanalyze It Make It
43:31 Happen solve problems along the way and
43:34 don’t give up right it’s that it’s that
43:36 intensity of it and I see it you’re like
43:38 a focused Guy this is what you do and
43:41 you’re gonna you’re G to get to the top
43:42 of the mountain no matter what I I
43:43 totally get that from you so it’s pretty
43:46 pretty powerful yeah I look forward to
43:47 seeing where you land on the the journey
43:48 and you know we’ll definitely have you
43:49 back on here in the future and to hear
43:51 more yeah would love to thank you guys I
43:53 appreciate it awesome thank you Sean
43:54 appreciate it nice meeting you you too
43:56 thank you for listening to the m&a
43:58 Launchpad podcast if you’ve enjoyed
43:59 today’s podcast and would like to
43:01 support us please leave us a rating and
43:02 a review after you listen I’m Casey minu
43:04 and I look forward to talking with you
43:06 next week